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The worst thing about studying Latin is that it's invaded my mind to the degree that I now almost feel like having five cases is reasonable.
in reply to Daniel Filan

"why not more? Why not make a dedicated instrumental case, or a locative that isn't a sewn-together monstrosity comprised by other cases?" - the sounds of a mind deranged by synthetic languages
in reply to Daniel Filan

Russian has six! Also the rules for declension in Russian depend on, among other things, whether something is animate. Are dolls animate? (Yes.) Are corpses? (Depends which word you're using.) Are bacteria? (Yes if you're a biologist, probably not otherwise.)


don't like this



I suspect that "epistemic and instrumental rationality" is better branded and lived as "nobility in thought and deed". But maybe I just have an unusual set of associations with the word "noble"? It's certainly more goal-laden than the word "rational" typically is.
in reply to Daniel Filan

The thing I mean is less altruistic than what David Chapman describes on this page but shares the feature of being valuable and possible.


So here's a dumb question about Jason Gross-style work on compact proofs that I don't want to ask totally publicly - what's the point? I see the value in making the case for interp as being for stuff like compact proofs. But I feel like we know that we aren't going to be able to find literal proofs of relevant safety properties of GPT-4, and we don't even know what those properties should be. So relevant next steps should look like "figure out heuristic arguments" and "figure out WTF AI safety even is" right? So why do more work getting compact proofs of various model properties?
in reply to Daniel Filan

I don't think it's obvious that we can't get proofs of any relevant safety properties. Like, yeah we're not going to get proofs of anything that references human preferences or whatever, but there might be relevant limited subquestions, e.g. about information capacity or something?
in reply to Ben Weinstein-Raun

I guess I just mean that it's really hard to prove anything about big NN behaviour - my understanding is if you try really hard you can do interval propagation in a smart way but that's about it.
This entry was edited (6 months ago)


A question bopping around my mind: are there things like making AXRP or being a MATS RM that I could do instead of those things that would be more valuable? Possible answers:
- just do research that matters
- project manager at a place that does research that matters
- be more directly a competitor to Zvi
- team up with Lawrence Chan and write stuff about various alignment schemes

I think a bottleneck I feel is being unsure about what things are valuable in the info environment, where I think I'm best placed to do stuff.






So like.... what's so good about trains? Why would someone think they are so much cooler than cars / trucks / aeroplanes?
in reply to Daniel Filan

  • Bigger / heavier
  • Stronger / move more stuff
  • Make way better sounds
in reply to Daniel Filan

The infrastructure is somehow really appealing (rails, railroad switches, signals). And there's something great about the way they glide along the track.


don't like this

in reply to kip

(I think my mind is actually like 80-90% back to normal now that it's been almost a week! so, on the faster end of my estimate)
in reply to kip

Ok random update on this. I now have a suspicion that I had physical trauma-effects that were delayed (and longer-lasting) compared to the psychological effects

The noticeable psychological impacts started after a day or so, and lasted maybe 4-5 days?

And I didn't have post-exertional malaise (PEM) right after the incident. But I started getting PEM really easily from other stuff

Here are charts from one of my health trackers. The incident was on the 17th. The top chart is my physical exertion per day (measured with HR data). (Ignore the final entry -- it's only so low because the day just started.) The bottom chart is my morning HRV readings. As you can see, they trended lower for a while after the incident.

Perhaps this decline will persist, but in the last few days, I started getting the feeling that I'm returning to a somewhat-less-severe baseline



Thing I just learned: the author of Paul: a Very Short Introduction, one of my favourite entries in the Very Short Introduction series and one I frequently recommend, is written by E. P. Sanders - one of the most prominent 20th century scholars on the apostle Paul and his thought. Self-recommending!
in reply to Daniel Filan

It really says something about where I'm at today, that it took multiple seconds before I realized you weren't talking about Paul Christiano.
in reply to Ben Weinstein-Raun

RIP I included 'apostle' or something in an earlier draft of this explicitly to counteract this, but randomly left it out of the final version. Fixing it.

in reply to Daniel Filan

In general on one hand I'm like "I'm so grateful English has so much grammar and vocabulary to make it so expressive" but when I see Latin I'm like "Japanese copes with just having past past and non-past plus some participles, why can't you" (not even getting to the whole thing of having different genders and different declensions for nouns and adjectives).
in reply to Daniel Filan

Ironically "coep-" is now the perfect stem I am perhaps least likely to forget.


Solstice notes


  • I like that the celebration took place on (or adjacent to) the actual solstice
  • I broadly thought this year's was worse than last year's, altho it had its charms
  • I liked "Humankind as a sailor" - tricky to pick up but rewarding once you did
  • Just because a song takes place in Australia, I don't think it thereby glorifies the negative aspects of colonialism.
  • The darkness speech was touching this year
  • I feel like a lot of the time the speaker would say something I straightforwardly agreed with in the way I would say it and everyone would laugh.
  • It was funny when Ozy said her favourite website was Our World in Data and Scott sang the praises of Dustin Moskowitz while I was sitting next to Oli
  • I think "the world is awful" is wrong, and not established by there being awful things in the world.
in reply to Daniel Filan

Also 'Humankind as a Sailor' is now on my non-core solstice music playlist and so popped up while I was on the rowing machine - total disaster, induced complete muscle confusion.


A big chunk of my current best-guess political philosophy is somewhat libertarian, the rough intuition being that in many important respects, things very often go better when people make their own choices, especially about how much things are worth to them.

This is a helpful framework when the agents in your economy / political system are relatively static entities. But as far as I know it doesn't really have anything to say about cases where one agent might mold another agent's preferences, or decide which agents to bring into existence.

Some examples include:

  • having children
  • many aspects of how children are raised
  • building AI agents
in reply to Ben Weinstein-Raun

This suggests that if we want to figure out a liberal philosophy of building AI, we should look to find liberal philosophies of child-rearing.
in reply to Daniel Filan

Also have I tried to sell you on the book "Rationalism, pluralism, and freedom" yet?
in reply to Ben Weinstein-Raun

It's one of these books where there's one idea and the rest of the book is not super interesting once you're sold on the idea but: academic.oup.com/book/2889
in reply to Daniel Filan

It doesn't answer your worries as far as I know, but feels like it offers conceptual vocabulary that's relevant.
in reply to Ben Weinstein-Raun

Population ethics is the ~one area where my moral intuitions bottom out at "there is no actual answer here". Most questions of morality intuitively feel like there is a right answer but thinking about population ethics consistently leaves me with no solid foundations and nowhere to get foundations.

(Related: how should we think about farming animals for meat, given that mostly they wouldn't exist otherwise?)



Proposed fun / slightly edgy party game: Perzendo

Materials: index cards and a pencil, or a google doc.

One player is the perzendo master. This perzendo master writes the names of two people in the room, in a list sorted by some secret property.

The other players take turns. On each turn, a player either proposes a name (of any human, living or dead), or tries to guess the property. The perzendo master puts these names on the list, wherever they fall according to the secret property.

The first player to guess the rule correctly wins.

in reply to Ben Weinstein-Raun

wouldn't the master quite often not know where they fall on the list? or does the property have to be something like "how much I personally want to ask them what's wrong with them" so that there's an answer even for people you've never heard of (presumably, not very much)
in reply to Ben Millwood

Yeah I think you either have to have an "I don't know" bucket, or it has to somehow be always up to the master's impression.


moving to alameda


I am currently in Sunnyvale, and it's genuinely astonishing how much less stuff there is down here than in the East Bay / SF. Like, people who are physically within San Jose still refer to San Francisco as "the city" despite San Jose having more people. Of the ~six dance events I'd like to be regularly going to, two are in SF and four are in Oakland, and zero are south of SF. Used to be one, where I met my wife, but it never recovered from Covid.

I'd guess there's more families in Sunnyvale than Oakland (... fact check: Sunnyvale is 20% minors, Oakland is 21%, so this is not true unless you quibble about definitions).

On the other hand Alameda is, from what I can tell, basically an ideal place for raising a family, and a lot of the island seems to lean into that (lots of Halloween decorations, e.g.; Halloween is our only child-focused holiday so this is a good signal of caring about doing things for children). And it's close to the rest of the East Bay, so I'm hoping I can get both the "good for family" and the "things ever happen" properties.

in reply to Kevin Gibbons

woo! congrats on getting it done. would be happy to see you and your wife/baby again when y'all aren't too swamped by boxes


Burned


in reply to Gretta Duleba

Yeah I've also shaved most of this yak herd before, and found it very frustrating :/ I think last time I ended up using Tutanota?

I guess in the movies they just want to use SMS or something.

This entry was edited (6 months ago)


I really like how smooth and clean this retention curve is - this is for my episode with Evan Hubinger, the height of the line is what fraction of viewers are still watching at any given time.


TIL that an experience that I've had ~once every month or so for my whole life, and assumed was near-universal, is actually relatively rare, and correlated with various bad things that I'm not aware of experiencing in relation to it (EBV infection, migraines, head trauma).

Basically, as I experience it (typically right as I'm falling asleep) everything visually starts to feel very small and far away, except that my tongue feels large and cumbersome in my mouth.

It's called Alice in Wonderland Syndrome; other people experience similar size distortions though the details vary a lot.

in reply to Ben Weinstein-Raun

I don't know if we have discussed this . . . but me, too. So maybe it was passed down.
in reply to Ben Weinstein-Raun

I have also experienced this!! Rarely, but enough for me to have noticed the pattern.


Mercer Girls


There are a bunch of places around Seattle named Mercer: Mercer Street, Mercer Island, Mercer Slough. We were walking in Mercer Slough today and I was trying to explain about Asa Mercer (one of the historical figures all this stuff is named after). I looked him up later. He looked like this.

One of his big claims to fame is that he brought the Mercer Girls to Seattle. Saith wikipedia:

The Mercer Girls or Mercer Maids were women who chose to move from the east coast of the United States to the Seattle area in the 1860s at the invitation of Asa Mercer. Mercer, an American who lived in Seattle, wanted to "import" women to the Pacific Northwest to balance the gender ratio. The women were drawn by the prospect of moving to a boomtown with a surplus of bachelors.


Now I'm imagining moving to Seattle in the 1860s and discovering that the men in Seattle did their hair like that. I am not entirely sure I would stay!



How much nesting can we do in English verb tenses, and what controls that? For an example of what I mean, I can say:
- I eat
- I will eat
- I will have been eating
- I will have been going to eat

But I don't think we can say "I will have been going to have eaten".

in reply to Daniel Filan

One possibility: basically it goes as far as it makes sense to add extra timing information. But this only works if you disagree about your last positive example, which I personally don't actually think I've ever heard used.

Like, imagine a timeline. "I eat" describes a period of time encompassing now. "I will eat" describes a period of time in the future. "I will have eaten" describes two times; one in the future and one in the past of that future. "I will have been going to eat" describes a time in the future, a time in the past of that future, and a time in the future of that past of the first future. But in some sense this collapses back to the semantic content of "I will eat", and so my guess is that it's basically never used.

in reply to Ben Weinstein-Raun

Or, maybe I think your last positive example is sometimes acceptable, but only if the "going to" is actually describing an intention rather than tense information.
in reply to Ben Weinstein-Raun

I guess I don't get why it makes sense to talk about two times but not three.
in reply to Daniel Filan

I think what I mean is that additional times around the loop aren't really adding any extra information, because they introduce new reference points along the timeline that typically don't connect to anything else.

Like, there's some implicit time T that I'm trying to locate with a given statement, and there's an additional time Now that I get from just being in the present.

It makes sense to be like "Some time between Now and [implicitly / contextually defined] T, X will happen", and this is ~ the two-level wrapping. But if you say "Some time between Now and [newly introduced / 'bound' / 'scoped-to-this-statement'] T1, it will be the case that X happened after [implicit / 'free' / contextual] T2", T1 is kind of irrelevant, since it's introduced and used only within the statement.

In principle I guess you could have extra context that disambiguates, but I think it's also kinda relevant that verbs tend to have a subject, a direct object, and up to one indirect object, and typically not more than that.

This entry was edited (6 months ago)
in reply to Ben Weinstein-Raun

idk, I'm not sure this actually makes sense; the real answer might just be "ultrafinite induction"
in reply to Ben Weinstein-Raun

Yeah I guess I'm stuck on "well why can't there be a bunch of relevant times".
in reply to Daniel Filan

Also FWIW I'm still stuck on the fact that however natural it is, I have a strong intuition that "I will have been going to eat" is grammatical in a way that "I will have been going to have eaten" is not.
in reply to Daniel Filan

my take is that arbitrary nesting is in some sense grammatical, but when interpreting things like this in the wild, I have to weigh up "they really mean the complicated thing" vs "they mean a simpler thing, but have said it incorrectly", and as the things become more complicated the latter explanation becomes more and more likely
This entry was edited (6 months ago)


Life Update, December 2024


in reply to Gretta Duleba

Overall sounds really exciting 🙂 - I hope the holidays are as unstressful as it's reasonable to hope for; sounds like a huge effort!

I have never heard of geezer gyms; maybe I should look into this?

in reply to Ben Weinstein-Raun

I don't think it's a real category except in my own mind! My gym is small, densely packed with equipment, clean, and full of senior citizens. I think they just know value when they see it. :)


The UHC CEO murder has made me feel like I'm surrounded by bad people. I get the sense that "the UHC CEO assassination was good" is the default leftist stance.

It seems so absurd to me. They agree that people are innocent til proven guilty, but they're happy for CEOs to get executed based on a really flimsy understanding of their behavior.

Someone who runs prominent events I enjoy posted something that was (IMO) kind of misguided and cruel. I used to think "maybe these people would hate me if they knew my views" -- now I'm thinking "maybe *I* can't accept *them*."

Hank Green expressed sympathy... for the murderer.

This is such hatred. Bigotry feels like an understatement.

I just ordered some colorful genderqueer clothing from an indie brand. Do they support the assassination? I want to pick up fresh local bread from Berkeley Bowl. What about them? Am I supporting bigots? I wish it were practical to get away from this.

in reply to kip

Oh thanks, that set of poll results is actually mildly relieving
in reply to Daniel Ziegler

oh good. to be clear I didn't mean to imply "look how bad things are!" -- more like "here's some actual data; yeah things aren't extremely bad"
in reply to kip

I posted about this on Facebook: facebook.com/share/p/Yg3bYqU18… (I think it would be more preaching to the choir here)


I've now rescheduled my entire life around getting a hernia consultation twice, only to have UCSF reschedule at the last minute.

kip doesn't like this.



"Vouching" / friend-of-friend interactions


in reply to Gina Stuessy

I just realized that a title isn't necessary here; I think the "Submit" button looks disabled even when it's not (FYI @Ben Weinstein-Raun --also, I got an error with the "like" button a bit ago, but I just tried it again on my own post and it seems to have worked, but now I can't remove it, so I look like a dufus)


MOAR AXRP


This time with Erik Jenner, on a paper he's presenting at NeurIPS tomorrow - check it out if you're there!

Lots of people in the AI safety space worry about models being able to make deliberate, multi-step plans. But can we already see this in existing neural nets? In this episode, I talk with Erik Jenner about his work looking at internal look-ahead within chess-playing neural networks.

Video
Transcript



Tried using a portable vertical #hamradio antenna in my back yard this evening, as a replacement for the one I took down from the tree. It worked okay. Nowhere near the coverage I was getting from the 107ft wire, but I did manage to make a couple ft8 QSOs a few states away (South Dakota being the furthest).


Llama 3.3-70b is quite good; I think it's clearly the best local model I've tried. Not quite as good as GPT-4 on things I've tried so far, but I think better than GPT-3.5.
in reply to [object Object]

I'm not sure; I have an MBP with 128GiB of unified memory, which is plenty.


A wind storm two nights ago took a big branch down from the tree my antenna was in, so I took the antenna down until we have a chance to get the tree looked at. Very sad to have to pause my FT8 fun, but even if this is the end for a while I've had a great time.


Pascal's Wager doesn't go far enough:

Granted, the Christian God offers infinite rewards, but as far as I can find this is always in terms of "eternal" life or "eternal" communion with him, and so we can be confident that he is offering rewards only as large as the cardinality of the continuum.

So come on down to Crazy Georg's Omega Plus First Church of G...d: If you can conceive of a God advertising any size of infinite reward, G...d will match it.

niplav reshared this.

in reply to Ben Weinstein-Raun

Granted, the Christian God offers infinite rewards, but as far as I can find this is always in terms of "eternal" life or "eternal" communion with him, and so we can be confident that he is offering rewards only as large as the cardinality of the continuum.


FWIW I think it's plausible that the Greek words used in the NT doesn't have this sort of connotation.

in reply to Daniel Filan

I would find this surprising, since I don't model the ancients as having concepts for infinity that could correspond to larger infinities than this
in reply to Ben Weinstein-Raun

I'm imagining that the words / concepts they used were vague enough to include those higher cardinals - e.g. my understanding is that a lot of the words that get translated as "everlasting" could also be translated as "of the ages".
in reply to Ben Weinstein-Raun

I found this relevant and interesting chapter from Unsong by thinking "hmm, but Omega is an ancient word in some sense, and it's been more recently used in the context of infinities... and Jesus also referred to 'alpha and omega' to represent something like infinitude. So I can probably make a joke about kabbalah. Oh, but Scott Alexander will have already done that."

unsongbook.com/interlude-%D7%9…

in reply to Ben Weinstein-Raun

This entry was edited (6 months ago)


What compression algorithm did God use to send Jesus to earth on Christmas?




On Friday I tried to show @Daniel Filan how FT8 works, but I was having a really hard time getting QSOs. I was worried something was wrong with my #hamradio antenna setup, since the internet claimed that band conditions should be good. But this afternoon and evening I had a great time and got 17 QSOs across 5 different bands! So I think Friday must have been something transient rather than my (very janky) setup degrading.

I now have confirmed QSOs in 40 states, and unconfirmed ones in all but 3! (North Dakota, Delaware, and Vermont. Almost managed to get one in Delaware today, but wasn't quite able to complete the protocol) Plus 28 "DX entities" (mostly countries, but includes e.g. Alaska and Hawaii separately) on 6 continents!

Map of listening stations that heard me this afternoon:

W0AMT Jon reshared this.



in reply to kip

"It is good when people are happy" is one of the things I am going to most prioritize trying to instill in my children.
in reply to kip

I think this is a good direction but encourage you not to completely lose empathy for the other reactions – people who still don't like being interrupted or mansplained to do have their reasons for that and I wouldn't want to respond to their negative reactions by saying "that reaction is unconditionally wrong"


Am now up to knowing five words for types of slave in Latin.


Ended up deactivating my facebook yesterday. I wish I could have emotionally handled whatever was going on, but the only way I know how to productively deal with expressions of anger at that depth, apparently doesn't scale past one or two people at a time.

Last night I felt really conflicted about it. Like, I had just been trying to get people to give me harsh feedback, hadn't I? Doesn't this undermine that, or feel like a petty table-flipping move?

I still have some of those worries, but today I'm feeling like it was obviously the right move. Like if I had a gangrenous limb or something and had cut it off: It's pretty awful that I lost a limb, but it's way better than losing my whole self. Plus in this case I can reattach it if I figure out how to get rid of the gangrene.

in reply to Ben Weinstein-Raun

what was going on on FB that made you want to deactivate it, if you want to share? the last thing I looked at of yours seemed to be positively received
in reply to Gina Stuessy

I think this was a different post; basically, I wrote a post about the United Healthcare CEO assassination (the gist was, "it's wrong to express glee about someone's death"). It got a decent number of mildly positive reactions, but also a small cascade of intense negative reactions, a couple of which were kinda vicious.

Daniel Filan doesn't like this.



It's so fucking shitty that the easy way to feel better when someone is angry at you is to totally dismiss them as crazy or evil.


Jeroen Henneman, The Long Way Home
From: https://x.com/opancaro/status/186529216161008481


Wilhelm Kranz
From: https://x.com/0zmnds/status/1865291905249980735

#art

#art



Just realized I've been paying for my old group house's internet for almost three years. I'm out $3000, since there's no way I'm asking them to pay me back all of that; it's my responsibility to look at my own bank statements. Honestly relieved my burn rate will drop, but also I really need to pay better attention to my account statements.
in reply to Ben Weinstein-Raun

if $3000 is too much to ask them to pay you back, surely they should at least pay you the maximal amount that isn't too much :P

minimally you could be like "I don't think it's fair for me to charge you the full amount but if you could think about what seems affordable / reasonable to you and pay me that I would be grateful"

although tbh I think it kind of is fair to at least suggest they might pay the full amount, even if you don't want to insist on it

This entry was edited (6 months ago)
in reply to Ben Weinstein-Raun

also thank you for this story because I do read and categorise my bank statement line items and sometimes I say this to people and they're like "why do you do this" and it is sometimes hard to have a good answer :P




Have you ever successfully caused yourself to love something that you didn't naturally love? How did you do that? I'm especially interested in cases where you made a conscious decision that you were going to learn to love the thing, and then succeeded via strategy.
in reply to Ben Weinstein-Raun

My not-quite-the-answer is that I think I've encouraged myself in loving things. There's a feeling of getting obsessed with something that I occasionally notice myself having. I can try to cultivate that intentionally. The most notable example where this felt like a real successful guidance was in getting really into Rust.